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Turd Fergusen

Veteran Member
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Legendary crooner Bob Dylan plied a 12-year-old girl with drugs and alcohol before sexually abusing her at his Chelsea Hotel apartment in 1965, an explosive new lawsuit alleges.

The “Blowin’ in the Wind” musician used his star status to groom, gain the trust of and control the victim “as part of his plan to sexually molest and abuse” her, according to the Manhattan Supreme Court papers, which only identify the plaintiff as “J.C.”
“Bob Dylan, over a six-week period between April and May of 1965 befriended and established an emotional connection with the plaintiff,” say the papers, which were filed late Friday on behalf of J.C., now a 68-year-old woman in Greenwich, Conn.

Full Article:
 
56 years ago? Shit that happened so long ago, at that age, could have been a dream or fantasy that evidently feels like it really happened.
From my experiences, with friends, personal and when I worked at the rape crisis line, this kind of thing can be emblazoned in one's mind. Victims can still describe every second of the assault decades and decades later. I'm not saying that you're wrong. I'm just saying that 56 years might as well be 56 minutes for a lot of survivors.
 
I am not a fan of Dylan. But 56 yrs ago this was a completely different world with a different outtake on things like this. I am also not knocking on the victim, just life then was slightly different.

And now that Dylan is 80 something, he probably can't remember this incident at all.
 
You just need to listen to some of the songs from the 50's and 60's and some 70's to know it was a very different time. The one I can think of right of this moment is Ringo Starr's You're 16
Don't forget Joan Jett's "I love rock 'n' roll", where she was sings about seducing a 17 year old boy who was standing by a juke box.
 
This is such a disheartening piece of news. I hope it is not true that Bob Dylan did that. 56 years after the fact seems like a long time ago to bring this up, but I do understand that people carry trauma with them their whole lives. (i.e. I can relate to this. And I dearly hope that people who do rotten things, whether to me or others, be found out for who they are: exposed, fearful, and nowhere to go except disgrace and social anathema. That is exactly what people like that deserve, perhaps even worse.)

This situation should be worked out between Dylan, the accuser, and the relevant courts. If this circumstance did happen, it would not change the fact that a 12-year-old was drugged and sexually exploited. It would also not change that Bob Dylan has had an invaluable and vibrant contribution to not just American music, but also to the world. As the voice of multiple generations, he has impacted musicians and non-musicians alike, and music history would not nearly be the same without him. He carried the folk traditions of old, electrified them in the late 1960s/early 1970s, and has done way more with music than most actual established musicians could ever dream of. The musical legacy of Michael Jackson, on the other hand, seems to ring hollow in comparison to that of Dylan (sidenote: I have exactly zero reservations about believing the molestation allegations against Jackson. I will never voluntarily listen to his songs again.)

As a personal anecdote, I was obsessed with Pink Floyd when I was in middle school. I wanted to branch out and not be exclusive to Pink Floyd anymore, after having collected most of their music on CD. My first CD purchase to capstone this decision was made in December 2005, when I bought Bob Dylan's Greatest Hits. I stay away from Greatest Hits and similar compilations these days, because the albums that artists intend are more important to me than a collection of random songs curated by a third party; but it still was a milestone purchase for me those 15+ years ago (It's been that long? Holy crap!).

I am not taking a side on this issue, and I will not weigh in on what is true and what is false about this. This is a dispute between two parties that needs to be solved as cleanly as possible. Whomever is in the wrong here should be held fully accountable for past and/or present moral lapses and inferiorities.

And I must remind everyone to suspend judgement; this is very important. One reason for this is because Clinton Heylin, who has written nine books about Bob Dylan (qualified expert, much?) is skeptical of the claims, and is citing verified timelines and whereabouts that would/could/does contradict the contexts and details relevant to the accusation. Heylin's denial on Dylan's behalf does not seem interested in victim-blaming either.

 
I guess Bob is lucky the accusation is during a period when his life was heavily documented. The accuser alleges a timeline that, according to his biographer, would make the alleged acts difficult if not impossible. I'm a huge Bob Dylan fan, so I hope these accusations are untrue.
 




May God bless and keep you always, May your wishes all come true, May you always do for others And let others do for you. May you build a ladder to the stars And climb on every rung,

May you stay forever young, Forever young, forever young, May you stay forever young.

May you grow up to be righteous, May you grow up to be true, May you always know the truth And see the lights surrounding you. May you always be courageous, Stand upright and be strong,

May you stay forever young, Forever young, forever young, May you stay forever young.

May your hands always be busy, May your feet always be swift, May you have a strong foundation When the winds of changes shift. May your heart always be joyful, May your song always be sung and may you stay forever young.

Forever young, Forever young, forever young, May you stay forever young.
 
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Bob Dylan.... America's true Poet Laureate
[automerge]1629330399[/automerge]
Oh, what’ll you do now, my blue-eyed son?
Oh, what’ll you do now, my darling young one?
I’m a-goin’ back out ’fore the rain starts a-fallin’
I’ll walk to the depths of the deepest black forest
Where the people are many and their hands are all empty
Where the pellets of poison are flooding their waters
Where the home in the valley meets the damp dirty prison
Where the executioner’s face is always well hidden
Where hunger is ugly, where souls are forgotten
Where black is the color, where none is the number
And I’ll tell it and think it and speak it and breathe it
And reflect it from the mountain so all souls can see it
Then I’ll stand on the ocean until I start sinkin’
But I’ll know my song well before I start singin’
And it’s a hard, it’s a hard, it’s a hard, it’s a hard
It’s a hard rain’s a-gonna fall
 
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I'm having a really hard time with this thread. So most of you are ok with a pedophile as long as you're a REALLY big fan of their music??

This is not looking good:

Bob Dylan’s 1965 tour dates don’t refute sex abuse allegations, lawyer says​

A lawyer for a woman who accused Bob Dylan of sexually abusing her when she was 12 in 1965 told Page Six that the musician’s tour schedule from the time doesn’t refute his client’s claims.

The alleged victim’s lawyer said that while Dylan was on tour in England and other places for parts of April and May — when his client claims the abuse occurred — there was still enough time for the “Like a Rolling Stone” crooner to get back to New York, where she said the incidents happened.

“Looking at the [tour] schedule — it’s not inconsistent with our client’s claims,” Daniel Isaacs told Page Six, in response to reports that the allegations by his client were inconsistent with Dylan’s tour schedule at the time. “We will prove our claims in the appropriate forum, which is in the court of law.”

“If Dylan was in New York in mid-April, it was for no more than a day or two,” Heylin told the news site.

Still, Isaacs stood by the lawsuit, saying, “There are dates that he wasn’t touring for several weeks in April and this will all come out at that appropriate time.”

“The claims were vetted before the case was filed and we did our research,” Isaacs said. “It’s our position that the evidence will establish that he was in New York during the relevant time period.”
 
I think it’s really odd that it comes out now.. it didn’t take me 65 years and a court of public opinion to push a lawsuit through.. that’s right I didn’t sue or jail anyone.. I live with my pain and I dealt with it accordingly to what helped me heal the most.. dragging all this stuff out so so so long after the fact.. she’s not after what is going to heal her she’s after money and fame and when everything settles regardless of truth or not she’s still going to be hollow, she’s still going to experience pain and memories and now she’s headed to become the psychological and monetary charity case.. congratulations on compiling whatever you are experiencing..
 
I'm having a really hard time with this thread. So most of you are ok with a pedophile as long as you're a REALLY big fan of their music??

This is not looking good:

Bob Dylan’s 1965 tour dates don’t refute sex abuse allegations, lawyer says​


Good, honest point there. Pedophilia needs to be stamped out and the guilty parties need to be fully accounted for. As I said in the last post, it is not my place presently to judge what did or did not happen. The information from your linked article is yet another reason to reserve judgement, and not yet go after either Dylan or JC with pitchforks and scowls when the conflict has not been fully fleshed out.

Emotively speaking, I hope it's not true. I exhibited a clear bias in my last post, in regard to my fanship of Bob Dylan, against an anonymous person who has had an unclear/unspecified/perhaps nonexistent previous cultural impact. Also, Dylan almost certainly has much more money than she does. That is how power imbalances work with cultural figures. That is an important factor in how America's Dad was able to not merely drug and rape dozens of women, but also likely be one of the most prolific serial rapists in American history.

We, as disinterested members of the public, simply don't know what did/did not happen. I fully support women speaking out about past abuse, and know that most of them are being either truthful or giving an honest rendering of what they feel happened. But since it's not true that posited victims are 100% truthful/accurate, and 100% of accused parties are guilty, we have the courts that can, hopefully at least, figure that out as best as possible what did or did not happen. Public opinion, while it has potential to align with the truth, is ultimately a distraction and a sideshow from the pursuit of justice. And that is why I feel that I, personally, am of no basis to take a position of Dylan's guilt or innocence. I have no idea how I'll cope if he does turn out to be guilty, but in the meantime, there is a lot to both prove and disprove about what may or may not have happened 56 years ago. (For perspective, that is 56% of an entire century.)

On the side, this does remind me of how Jerry Lee Lewis married his 13-year-old cousin, which caused lots of controversy and anger at the time. He is still known as one of the brash and charismatic personalities of the founding stages (that means two things) of rock n' roll; but he, for that and other reasons, is one helluva sketchy character.

This whole thing is so sad.
 
I'm not fine with pedophiles at all, but so far there is an allegation and nothing more. That's nowhere near enough for me to condemn him. In addition, even if it did turn out to be true, it doesn't make him less of a poet or musician, it makes him a poet who did a shitty thing.
 
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Again, I am not holding him up because, honestly I don't like him. His voice annoys the fuck out of me. But just saying, this person is now coming forward with allegations that at this stage no one can prove or disprove. Secondly the time 50+ years ago, no one would have ever thought it was manipulation. It just was. It was not until the late 80s that things like this started to change, as more and more were affected by the antics of adults were realizing that this shit is wrong
 
I love Dylan. Saw him live at MSG in the late 90's. In reality, she was 12. it probably took her a long time to realize it was even wrong. Lot's of girls believe that attention from an older guy at that age means "they're mature" or he's really into them. Some young girls can be convinced with a simple "I love you" if their home life is rotten enough. I genuinely hope it's not true, but as others have said before me, it was a different time and a lot of shit and shit behavior was excused or swept under the rug. If it's true and proven I hope she gets justice.
 
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